Munich helles and dunkel

[bigdan]

Trying to figure out the water stuff for a Munich helles and dunkel. My water profile is:
pH 8.4
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est 143
Electrical Conductivity, mmho/cm 0.24
Cations / Anions, me/L 1.7 / 2.0
ppm
Sodium, Na 8
Potassium, K 2
Calcium, Ca 16
Magnesium, Mg 7
Total Hardness, CaCO3 69
Nitrate, NO3-N 0.5 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 3
Chloride, Cl 8
Carbonate, CO3 3
Bicarbonate, HCO3 88
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 77

I am going to do an extract batch of both though. Should I adjust my water? Any help would be great. Thanks

[mattmacleod]

Water chemistry arguably has most affect during the mash. If you're brewing extract, the mash has already been done for you, so unless your water is really extreme I don't think you need to worry.

Your water looks fine so the only thing you might want to worry about is chlorine/chloramines, especially in the dunkel. If in doubt just use store bought water.

[ajdelange]

Helles and Dunkles are the classic example of how water treatment influences the beer styles origially brewed from it. Munich water is quite alkaline (280 or so) but otherwise pretty devoid of minerals with the excpetion of modest amounts of calcium, magnesium and nitrate ion. The calcium and magnesium are not enough to offset the pH raising effects of the alkalinity and so the monks found that adding dark malt improved the beer. When it was later learned that the water could be decarbonated the dark malt was no longer necessary and Helles was born. Your water is a little too alkaline for Helles (RA 60) though you could probably brew it sucessfully without treatment. The beer might not have that Helles "soft" quality as your water has more mineral content than decarbonated Munich water does. It is definitely less alkaline than Munich water so you should be able to brew Dunkles with it with no trouble at all.

As has been pointed out for extract brewing this is mostly moot as mash pH is not a consideration in extract brewing. The soft quality of Helles is probably not something that can be produced from an extract bee in any case so that should not be of concern.

[bigdan]

So with extract I won't be able to replicate a helles very well. what if I cut my water with distilled. Or would it still be better to do it all grain. I was just hoping to get both don pretty quick tomorow. Thanks

[ajdelange]

I'm guessing that the extract will have more of an influence than the water but then people have made some excellent extract beers. You could try it with distilled water, of course, but then if the plant that made the extract had high mineral content water these will carry over into the extract and your beer. It is always better to do all grain, IMO, because you have more control and knowledge about what went into the ultimate product.

[bigdan]

I'm with you on the all grain. I'm just trying to get some beer in the fermentor. It make since to me to use the distilled instead of adding more minerals to the extract. I guess there would be no point in adding alkalinity for this style with out knowing what the extract would start out with. Thanks