temp step mash help

[raef]

I am going to brew a recipe that has 13 pounds grain including one pound rice hulls, the recipe calls for protein rest @ 122 degrees for 15 minutes, sacc. rest at 151 degrees for 60 minutes, mash out 170 degrees for 15 minutes. i have a couple questions. What do i need to do with the rice hulls beforehand if anything? How much water at what temps do i need to add to achieve the afore mentioned mash steps? And what amount of water do i need to sparge?
It is a five gallon batch. Thanks for any help

[ajdelange]

I am going to brew a recipe that has 13 pounds grain including one pound rice hulls, the recipe calls for protein rest @ 122 degrees for 15 minutes, sacc. rest at 151 degrees for 60 minutes, mash out 170 degrees for 15 minutes. i have a couple questions. What do i need to do with the rice hulls beforehand if anything?

If you are using rice hulls that means you fear the grain husks are damaged and cant form a filter bed. Based on this it makes senst to spare the rice hulls any possible damage from the stirring/mixing you will be doing during the mash. IOW add them to the lauter tun as you add the mash.

How much water at what temps do i need to add to achieve the afore mentioned mash steps?

There are dozens of calculators and spreadheets and, I'll bet iPhone Apps, that will do the calculations for you. They aren't complicated and can be easily programmed into Excel if you prefer that approach.

I think a few minutes with a calculator will convince you that going from protein rest to mashout with infusions will result in a huge volume of thin mash for the lauter tun. After sparging you will have a huge volume of liquid which will have to be evaporated away. It depends on initial water to grist ratio, losses of you mash tun (i.e. how much water you must infuse to maintiain temperature) but its probably that you will need to at least maintain, if not step, via external heat applications. O could be wrong on this as I haven't done an infusion mash in probably 20 years.

And what amount of water do i need to sparge?

As much as it takes to reduce the gravity of the runnings to whatever level you want to reduce them to consistent with the amount of liquid you want to have to evaporate and phenol extraction from the husks (runoff pH). I post here more details about the equipment you are using, whether you plan to batch or flu sparge... in the hopes that someone working in similar fashion might be able to give more specific advice.

[maxwell]

In my opinion, rice hulls should not be part of the recipe. For instance, I use rice hulls in every batch because they allow me to vorlauf slightly less and run off a little bit faster, but if your equipment and crush are such that you don't need rice hulls normally, don't add them. Some people only need rice hulls when using a large percentage of adjuncts like oats or rye. I usually rehydrate rice hulls in very hot water, changing the water several times to remove any dust-sized particles and unpleasant flavors.

[ajdelange]

I usually rehydrate rice hulls in very hot water, changing the water several times to remove any dust-sized particles and unpleasant flavors.

Interesting. Have you ever noted any unpleasant flavors that you have attributed to rice hulls? I use them in every single beer I do and have not had any reports of any off flavors. The hulls themselves are about as flavorless as anything I've ever tasted. A hot waer extract isn't flavorless but the flavor isn't unpleasant by any means nor is it very strong in a test where the ratio of water to hulls is a lot lower than it would be in a lauter/sparge. I guess as this is husk material we should worry about phenol extraction at high temperature but the mash pH should protect us from that.

I certainly have never thought of this. I guess I could throw them into the lauter tun, cover them with hot water, let them sit a minute or 2 and then drain before pumping in any mash. I think I may try that next time I brew.

And I agree that if you don't need them you shouldn't bother with them. I don't have that option though.

[DBear]

For a six gallon batch ~12lbs grain) I have done a two stage mash with infusions the first .8qts/lb (133F -15min) and then enough 210F water to bring me to 150F for 40min - total mash ratio with the two steps 1.5qt/lb.

That was a long time ago and I don't remember how the batch turned out but I do remember I hit the temp and mash ratio numbers.

[Cliff]

I don't think there are any rules.

I usually throw my hills in the bottom of my MT and leave 'em there.

No soaking no rinsing no nothing I just dump 'em in.
Then, when I stir the mash, I try not to scrape the bottom layer up. leaving the rice against the screen protecting it from any goo.