Beer Forum

Would anyone know some good substitutes for the three carafa malts? Starting to brew some porters and stouts that call for carafa 2 and carafa 3 but my LHBS doesn't carry any of them.

The two recipes I am brewing in particular is JP's oak aged stout and the CYBI smoked porter. Any insight is greatly appreciated and Thanks ahead of time.

TONY

If you really want to brew those recipes I would just wait and try to get the malts you really need. Doubtless you can brew some great porters and stouts with other roasted grains, but it's not going to be the same.

You might consider Belgian Debittered Black Malt if your LHBS carries it. It has a 500SRM and may be able to get you into the Carafa III range. But, there really is no substitute for Carafa. I believe Briess is coming out with a debittered black malt here as well according to an advertisement I saw in BYO or Zymurgy. You could always see if your LHBS could special order it, or try one of the online stores like Northern Brewer.

Carafa IS NOT DEBITTERED.

American chocolate (~300-50) substitues for carafa I which is typically around 300
UK chocolate (usu. ~400) can sub for carafa ii
black malt (~500) can sub for carafa iii

however, these #s all vary by malster. Carafa is a trademark of Weyermann so it always has the same colors.

Carafa Special is debittered.

There are domestic and german debittered black malts, but these are typically on a substitute for special three.
I can't think of a real substitutes for the lower lovibond, though maybe the debittered black malts vary in lovibond by producer

When I picked up the grains for JP's stout a couple of weeks ago they substituted the carafa 2 with an equal amount of De-Bittered Black barley and of Black barley which ended up to be 4% of my grain bill (.5lb total). Then added about 1oz of black patent, for what reason I don't know. It smells and tastes good but the color is a little light, more like a dark brown.

The smoked porter calls for carafa 3 JP used carafa 2 when he brewed it. Should I just use black barley? I would consider ordering exactly what I need but I plan on reusing my yeast for this weekends brew. If I use de-bittered would it be a more smooth flavor profile?

Here's what I am working with.
http://www.austinhomebrew.com/index.php?cPath=178_21_71_112

Tony

Can you get your hands on Roasted Wheat Malt? Its generally around the same Lovibond as Carafa Spec III & is huskless (like the Carafa spec) therefore a little smoother than regular Roasted Malt - I like to use it in my Schwarzbier. Chocolate Wheat could also be subbed for II I'd guess.

Edit: just noticed that Austin have it listed as Midnight Wheat. I see they have Choc Wheat too.

tcmonk wrote:When I picked up the grains for JP's stout a couple of weeks ago they substituted the carafa 2 with an equal amount of De-Bittered Black barley and of Black barley which ended up to be 4% of my grain bill (.5lb total). Then added about 1oz of black patent, for what reason I don't know. It smells and tastes good but the color is a little light, more like a dark brown.

The smoked porter calls for carafa 3 JP used carafa 2 when he brewed it. Should I just use black barley? I would consider ordering exactly what I need but I plan on reusing my yeast for this weekends brew. If I use de-bittered would it be a more smooth flavor profile?

Here's what I am working with.
http://www.austinhomebrew.com/index.php?cPath=178_21_71_112

Tony

JP used carafa ii but it called for special iii

That said I don't think the regular carafa is a direct substitute for black malt. All of the Weyermann cara malts are crystal malts of some sor

I would suggest ordering the malts you need online, or asking your LHBS to order some for you, they are there to sell products to you, so if you tell them what/how much you need they will most likely order it for you.

I agree that we should all try to support our LHBS (We don't have one in my area), but I do not like altering from planned ingredeants when brewing, no matter how subtile there is no exact substitution for any malt especially when you are talking about the darker roast malts.