BS Remover from Five Star

[BigBadBrad]

I, like many of you, have been using an oxygen cleaner instead of PBW for a while now to save some money. I also know that many of us do not use the proper amount of cleaning and sanitizing chemicals. I have recently had some great conversations with a representative from Five Star Chemicals that have been pretty eye opening. I expressed to her that many home brewers are like myself and we are cheap and don't necessarily follow directions very well. She explained to me why the products are formulated the way they are and that using more than the recommended amount of any chemical is not beneficial. In addition, Five Star just recently introduced a new beer stone remover for home brewers cleverly called BS Remover. The representative was kind enough to send me some samples of PBW and BS Remover so I could see for myself what a difference proper use of these products could do.

I had to do some renovations on my keggles so I could use the BS Remover since it is too acidic to use on copper. I swapped out my homemade copper dip tubes in my boil kettle and hot liquor tank with compression fittings and stainless tubing from Brewers Hardware. I also took the opportunity to swap out my old economy ball valves with quick clean ball valves. See the gross inside of one of the old ball valves.


Now that my kettles were copper free, I cleaned them using PBW on my Mark's Keg Washer and a CIP ball. Did you know that you only need 3/4 oz. of PBW per gallon of water? That's not much. The keg washer basin holds 1.75 gallons of water, so I measured out the proper amount of PBW. The keggles had already been cleaned using oxygen cleaner after my last brew day, but the PBW still removed a bunch of soil. After rinsing the keggles with hot water, I was ready to try out the BS Remover at a rate of 1/2 oz. per gallon. The BS Remover helps remove that stubborn beer stone and re-passivates the stainless steel when you allow the surface to air dry after use. You can see the before and after pictures below as well as the amount of beer stone that was left in the bottom of the keg washer basin.




So, what did I learn from all this? First, it pays to be nice to the Five Star rep. Second, I will never be cheap again when it comes to my cleaning regimen. If you don't see BS Remover available at your LHBS, ask for them to order it from Five Star.

[Ozwald]

I've always been a proponent of PBW & FiveStar in general. If you want to be cheap, you can reuse PBW over and over and over. I would store 10 gallons of it in 2 sealed buckets. I'd pour off the crud that would settle to the bottom, but I'd only make a new batch when I just couldn't stand the smell of it anymore. Even then, it was still cleaning like a boss. You don't have to keep it that long, obviously, but I think you're wasting it if you're not getting at least 2-3 uses out of a batch.

[Brewshki]

I've always been a proponent of PBW & FiveStar in general. If you want to be cheap, you can reuse PBW over and over and over. I would store 10 gallons of it in 2 sealed buckets. I'd pour off the crud that would settle to the bottom, but I'd only make a new batch when I just couldn't stand the smell of it anymore. Even then, it was still cleaning like a boss. You don't have to keep it that long, obviously, but I think you're wasting it if you're not getting at least 2-3 uses out of a batch.

i have done this before too and I was getting much worse results that a fresh batch. When I make a new batch, I use hot water per the instructions and it cleans my plastic fermentors like a dream. When I pour it out and save it, it never works as well the nest time. There is very often, leftover karusen or bits of hops on the plastic. Any tips? I would love to be able to re-use it.

[brewinhard]

Good cleaning tips and man, what a difference on that stainless.

[BigBadBrad]

I think if you can come up with a CIP spray ball solution, you will use less PBW in the long run. I used to fill a corny keg with PBW solution, let it soak for a while, then push the solution with CO2 to the next keg. I would wait until I had several kegs to clean before I did this. With the keg washer, I can do the same thing with 1.75 gallons of water instead of 5 gallons. Plus, the CIP spray ball does a better job of cleaning due to the agitation. Technically, this is not CIP since you have to move the equipment, but the cleaning concept is the same.

I have never tried storing PBW in a solution, but I suppose it would work even if the cleaning power was reduced over time.

[NateBrews]

I'm not sure what show it was, maybe Brew Strong from way back, but they did a show on Five Star stuff and the person was saying that PBW has stuff in it that gets used up (I think it was the oxygen cleaning component, the stuff that fizzes as it cleans). After that, the stuff will still work but it is somewhat less effective.

I use it in my Mark II carboy cleaner and it works great for a few times over. I also tend to use it at about 1/2 strength and give it more time. Time, Temperature, Agitation...if you can't get one of those then increase the others.

[Ozwald]

I've always been a proponent of PBW & FiveStar in general. If you want to be cheap, you can reuse PBW over and over and over. I would store 10 gallons of it in 2 sealed buckets. I'd pour off the crud that would settle to the bottom, but I'd only make a new batch when I just couldn't stand the smell of it anymore. Even then, it was still cleaning like a boss. You don't have to keep it that long, obviously, but I think you're wasting it if you're not getting at least 2-3 uses out of a batch.

i have done this before too and I was getting much worse results that a fresh batch. When I make a new batch, I use hot water per the instructions and it cleans my plastic fermentors like a dream. When I pour it out and save it, it never works as well the nest time. There is very often, leftover karusen or bits of hops on the plastic. Any tips? I would love to be able to re-use it.

Heat it up.

I'd rinse out the mashtun, run water through the HERMS/RIMS loop, dump it, then do the same with the PBW, only using the RIMS tube to heat it up. If you're running HERMS, use the HLT to heat up the post-PBW rinse water & you can run the PBW through that loop to heat it up. You always want to rinse it hotter & longer. I run PBW at 50C & rinsed at 60C. I don't recall the timing. It's not all that important for the cleaning aspect, but more for how it fit in with the brew day. I could get it done during the boil & still have time to get that same pump back in service before the 15 minute hop timer went off.

I don't think it reduces in cleaning power over time. I used it until it smelled so bad you couldn't stand to open the buckets inside. IIRC, I used one batch for several months (I'd add a little water/powder to top it up after pouring off the crud). It cleaned just as well on the last time as it did on the first. It just didn't smell or look too pretty. Still rinsed perfectly clean.

Like I said, you don't have to go that far with it, but at least get a few uses out of it.

[Brewshki]

I've always been a proponent of PBW & FiveStar in general. If you want to be cheap, you can reuse PBW over and over and over. I would store 10 gallons of it in 2 sealed buckets. I'd pour off the crud that would settle to the bottom, but I'd only make a new batch when I just couldn't stand the smell of it anymore. Even then, it was still cleaning like a boss. You don't have to keep it that long, obviously, but I think you're wasting it if you're not getting at least 2-3 uses out of a batch.

i have done this before too and I was getting much worse results that a fresh batch. When I make a new batch, I use hot water per the instructions and it cleans my plastic fermentors like a dream. When I pour it out and save it, it never works as well the nest time. There is very often, leftover karusen or bits of hops on the plastic. Any tips? I would love to be able to re-use it.

Heat it up.

I'd rinse out the mashtun, run water through the HERMS/RIMS loop, dump it, then do the same with the PBW, only using the RIMS tube to heat it up. If you're running HERMS, use the HLT to heat up the post-PBW rinse water & you can run the PBW through that loop to heat it up. You always want to rinse it hotter & longer. I run PBW at 50C & rinsed at 60C. I don't recall the timing. It's not all that important for the cleaning aspect, but more for how it fit in with the brew day. I could get it done during the boil & still have time to get that same pump back in service before the 15 minute hop timer went off.

I don't think it reduces in cleaning power over time. I used it until it smelled so bad you couldn't stand to open the buckets inside. IIRC, I used one batch for several months (I'd add a little water/powder to top it up after pouring off the crud). It cleaned just as well on the last time as it did on the first. It just didn't smell or look too pretty. Still rinsed perfectly clean.

Like I said, you don't have to go that far with it, but at least get a few uses out of it.

any thoughts on how to heat it up without a HERMS set-up. without a keg washer that uses way less volume, the only way I could think of doing it would be using my kettle and burner and I am curious if it is worth it at that point.